Scheitlin von St.Gallen SG

[Nemeses]

Deutsche Zusammenfassung folgt weiter unten - ebenso Literaturhinweise sowie eine Zusammenfassung Ortsbürgerbuch und auszugsweise eine Linie aus der Stemmatologia Sangallensis.
=========================

I am in the USA, and seeking information on the Scheitlin family of canton St. Gallen. Although I do have information on 7 generations of the family, going tentatively back to 1828/1830 in St. Gallen, my information on the family prior to emigration from St. Gallen to America is incomplete or needs verification. I would also like to find out any general information that might be known about the family, such as where they originally came from before settling in St. Gallen -- which I believe occurred about 1511 with Hans Scheitlin.

I will provide below the information I have on the 2 generations of St. Gallen Scheitlins. If anyone would like a copy of my entire report on the 7 generations of Scheitlins (the other 5 generations being the Scheitlins after emigrating to America), I would be happy to provide that.

Any assistance with my research on the Scheitlin family as they resided in canton St. Gallen would be very much appreciated.

Below is a 3-generation descendant of the St. Gallen Scheitlins. And because of it's length, I will not post the detailed genealogical report on the family, but will instead provide a link to the report for your convenience: Descendants of Bartholome Scheitlin of St. Gallen [this link does not work any longer in 2023 - instead visit viewtopic.php?p=120366#p120366]


1 [3] Bartholome Scheitlin
.... +Elsbetha Kuhn
.... 2 [1] Martin Sebastian Scheitlin 1814 - 1874
....... +Maria Rosa Dau'Jourd'Hui 1811 - 1847
....... 3 Maria Barbara Rosina Scheitlin 1837 - 1837
....... 3 Olisette Pauline Scheitlin 1838 - Unknown
....... 3 Maria Othilia Scheitlin 1839 - 1862
.......... +Rudolf Thalmann
....... 3 Josef Sebastian Scheitlin 1841 - 1841
....... 3 Jacob Sebastian Scheitlin 1844 - 1846
....... 3 Gottfried Scheitlin 1846 - 1846
.... *2nd Wife of [1] Martin Sebastian Scheitlin:
.......... +Maria Clara Dau'Jourd'Hui 1828 - 1878
....... 3 [2] Ludwig Eduard Scheitlin 1848 - 1923 i: 1880 Arrived in U.S. from native Switzerland
.......... +Maria Josephine Tobler - 1892 i: 1880 Arrived in U.S. from native Switzerland
.... *2nd Wife of [2] Ludwig Eduard Scheitlin:
.......... +Maria Johanna Tobler 1851 - 1898
....... 3 Barbara Clara Scheitlin 1854 - 1855
.... 2 Maria Ursula Scheitlin 1815 - 1815
.... 2 Anna Othilia Scheitlin 1816 - Unknown
....... +Gottfried Schneider
....... 3 Robert Heinrich Schneider 1849 - 1920
.......... +Paulina Zwicker 1849 - 1934
.... 2 Ursula Elisabetha Scheitlin 1817 - 1819
.... 2 Hector Scheitlin 1819 - 1819
.... 2 Gottfried Scheitlin 1820 - 1820
.... 2 Gottfried Scheitlin 1821 - 1896 i: 1848 From Switzerland
....... +Sophie Behn 1841 - 1907 i: 06 Sep 1862 From Hamburg, Germany
....... 3 Gottfried Scheitlin 1864 - 1942
.......... +Frieda M. Gattiker 1867 - 1935 i: 1888 From Switzerland
....... 3 Emma Sophie Scheitlin 1867 - 1943
.......... +Henry Zollinger 1867 - 1943 i: 1887 From Switzerland
....... 3 Albert Scheitlin 1873 - 1930
.......... +Rosa Augusta Ritter 1877 - 1952
.... 2 Heinrich Scheitlin 1822 - 1822
.... 2 Anna Scheitlin 1823 - 1886
.... 2 Ursula Elisabeth Scheitlin 1824 - 1893
....... +John Conrad Oswald 1824 - Emigration: May 1847 Emigrated to America
....... 3 Matilda Ann Oswald 1857 - Unknown
.......... +Theophil Edward Basting
....... 3 Elisabeth Sophie Oswald 1861 -
.......... +Floyd M. Laraway
....... 3 Bertha Maria Oswald 1863 -
....... 3 Emma Oswald 1864 -
.......... +William L. O'Brien
.... 2 Maria Scheitlin 1825 - 1873
....... +Josef Anton Horler Unknown - Unknown
.... 2 Heinrich Bartholome Scheitlin 1827 - 1827
.... 2 Bartholome Scheitlin 1828 - 1889
.... 2 John Bartholome Scheitlin 1830 - 1913
....... +Ann Samantha Button 1839 - 1919
....... 3 Fayette Tell Scheitlin 1858 - 1859
....... 3 Laura Scheitlin 1862 - 1863
....... 3 Harry Bartholome Scheitlin 1866 - 1961
.......... +Elizabeth Cameron 1874 - 1951
....... 3 Marion G. Scheitlin 1870 - 1936
.......... +Olive J. Davis 1869 - 1961
*Partner of [3] Bartholome Scheitlin:
.......... +Anna Marie Bondt
.... 2 Barbara Scheitlin 1833 -

[Wolf]

Dawn Gopalan aus den USA sucht Angaben zur Familie Scheitlin von St.Gallen. Im 19. Jahrhundert wandern mehrere Scheitlin nach Amerika aus. Im obigen Beitrag sind Angaben zur Auswanderergeneration sowie (soweit bekannt) zu den beiden vorangehenden, noch in der Schweiz lebenden Generationen wiedergegeben. Diese Angaben sollten aber noch verifiziert und ggf. ergänzt werden. Eine Zusammenstellung der Nachkommen in den USA wird bei Interesse gerne zur Verfügung gestellt oder kann online abgrufen werden unter Nachkommen des Bartholome Scheitlin von St.Gallen [dieser Link funktioniert 2023 nicht mehr - besuchen Sie stattdessen viewtopic.php?p=120366#p120366].

Jede Unterstützung bei der Erforschung der Familie, Hinweise auf Literatur sowie die ursprüngliche Herkunft (die Scheitlin sind seit 1511 in St.Gallen nachweisbar) wird dankbar entgegengenommen.

[Wolf]

English version below

Laut Familiennamenbuch sind Scheitlin vor 1800 nur in der Stadt St.Gallen verbürgert. Später lassen sich Linien auch anderswo einbürgern:
1864 Chancy GE
1948 Luzern LU
1952 Genève GE
1953 Winterthur ZH
1953 Zürich ZH

Im Historischen Lexikon der Schweiz sind Artikel vorgesehen (aber noch nicht online) zu folgenden Personen:
Scheitlin Emil 1876-1963, Maschinenbauingenieur, Dr.h.c (ETH Zürich).
Scheitlin Karl Peter 1809-1901, Buchhändler, Bezirksgerichtspräsident.
Scheitlin Oskar 1861-1924, Kaufmann in Burgdorf.
Scheitlin Peter 1779-1848, Pfarrer, Prof. am Gelehrtenkollegium.

Der "von Moos" nennt folgende Quellen:

A.H. Das Geschlecht der Scheitlin [von St.Gallen]. o.O.u.J., S.183-217 (Kopien in der Vadiana St. Gallen)

Steinmann Michael: Stammtafel des Leonhard Scheitlin [von St.Gallen] der Elsbetha Rietmann. St. Gallen um 1740, 1 Blatt (in der Vadiana St.Gallen)

Wild Kaspar: Etat der in St.Gallen verburgerten Familien Scheitlin. Mit einigen genealogischen Notizen. St. Gallen 1844 (in der Vadiana St.Gallen)

Stammbaum der Familie Scheitlein in St.Gallen. o.O. vor 1900 - 1 Blatt

Fankhauser Frank: 300 Jahre Entwicklung einer Emmentaler Firma, 1630-1936. Geschichte der Leinenwebereien Worb & Scheitlin AG, Burgdorf [betrifft die Familie Scheitlin von St.Gallen]. Zürich 1936 - 159 S.,genealogische Tafel (in der SGFF-Bibliothek)

Oehler Robert: Genealogie des Geschlechtes Scheitlin von St.Gallen. Bern 1950 -105 S. (in der Vadiana St. Gallen)

According to Familiennamenbuch have before 1800 only been citizens of the city of St.Gallen. Later lines gained other citizenships as well:
1864 Chancy GE
1948 Luzern LU
1952 Genève GE
1953 Winterthur ZH
1953 Zürich ZH

In the Swiss Historical Encyclopaedia articles on the following persons are planned (but not yet online):
Scheitlin Emil 1876-1963
Scheitlin Karl Peter 1809-1901
Scheitlin Oskar 1861-1924
Scheitlin Peter 1779-1848

The "von Moos" lists the following references:

A.H. Das Geschlecht der Scheitlin [von St.Gallen]. o.O.u.J., S.183-217 (Kopien in der Vadiana St. Gallen)

Steinmann Michael: Stammtafel des Leonhard Scheitlin [von St.Gallen] der Elsbetha Rietmann. St. Gallen um 1740, 1 Blatt (in der Vadiana St.Gallen)

Wild Kaspar: Etat der in St.Gallen verburgerten Familien Scheitlin. Mit einigen genealogischen Notizen. St. Gallen 1844 (in der Vadiana St.Gallen)

Stammbaum der Familie Scheitlein in St.Gallen. o.O. vor 1900 - 1 Blatt

Fankhauser Frank: 300 Jahre Entwicklung einer Emmentaler Firma, 1630-1936. Geschichte der Leinenwebereien Worb & Scheitlin AG, Burgdorf [betrifft die Familie Scheitlin von St.Gallen]. Zürich 1936 - 159 S.,genealogische Tafel (in der SGFF-Bibliothek)

Oehler Robert: Genealogie des Geschlechtes Scheitlin von St.Gallen. Bern 1950 -105 S. (in der Vadiana St. Gallen)

I'll have a look at Vadiana what might be most useful for you.

[Wolf]

Quelle: Wappenbuch der Stadt St.Gallen

English version below

1829 wurde erstmals ein "Etat der Bürgerschaft der Stadt St.Gallen" publiziert - seit 1864 erschien (nicht ganz) regelmaessig (meistens im 10-Jahresabstand) das "Bürgerbuch der Ortsbürgergemeinde St. Gallen", dessen Ausgabe von 2000 auch online abrufbar ist (kostenlose Registrierung notwendig). Im Folgenden eine Zusammenfassung aus in mehreren gedruckten Ausgaben gemachten Angaben.

Scheitlin sind ein altes bürgerliches Geschlecht, dessen Herkunft unbekannt ist. Die Augsburger Familie von Scheitlin steht mit den St.Galler Scheitlin in keiner Beziehung. Zwischen 1430 und 1530 kommt in St.Gallen ein Geschlecht Schitli vor. Der Name ist mit Scheitlin ethymologisch verwandt, Hinweise auf einen genealogischen Zusammenhang gibt es jedoch nicht.

Das Geschlecht der Scheitlin in St.Gallen beginnt mit Hans, der 1511 vorkommt.
Gemeinsamer Stammvater aller Scheitlin ist Anton, 1566-1629, Bleichemeister; 24 seiner Nachkommen in 10 aufeinanderfolgenden Generationen waren Bleicher und Bleichemeister.
Ferner sind zu nennen
Otmar, 1563-1622, Lateinlehrer, Pfarrer, Dekan.
Christoph, 1591-1646, Rektor des Gymnasiums, Stadtrichter.
Leonhard, 1655-1737, Bleichemeister, Hauptmann der Stadtmiliz.
Hans Jakob, 1692-1759, Zunftmeister, Obervogt zu Bürglen.
Bernhard, 1700-1768, Zunftmeister, Rats- und Bauherr.
Bernhard, 1765-1836, Seelamtsmüller, Gemeinderat, Stadtrat und Bauherr.
Peter, 1779-1848, Pfarrer in Kerenzen, seit 1805 Professor in St.Gallen, erster Stadtpfarrer, Dekan, Stifter und Präsident des Wissenschaftlichen Vereins, Präsident der Singgesellschaft zum "Antlitz", 1838 Begründer der Palmsonntagskonzerte, Mitstifter und Präsident des Kunstvereins, Präsident des Gewerbevereins, Gründer und Präsident der kantonalen Landwirtschaftlichen Gesellschaft.
Johann Michael, 1795-1859, Präsident des Bürgerrates.
Leonhard Gustav Adolf, 1804-1882, Apotheker, Gemeinderat.
Karl Peter, 1809-1901, Buchhändler, Bürgerrat, Bezirksgerichtspräsident.
Peter Alfred August, 1839-1892, Kaufmann, Waisenamtspräsident, Erziehungsrat.
Walter, 1853-1932, Kaufmann, Bürgerrat.
Gottlieb Heinrich, 1857-1926, Vorsteher der Gewerbeschule.
Albert Karl, 1866-1932, Dr. iur., Bezirksammann, Präsident des Konzertvereins.
Emil, 1876-1963, Maschineningenieur, Dr.sc.techn. h.c., auf dem Gebiet des Dampfturbinen-, Dampfkessel- und Hochdruckkompressorenbaus und des Sulzer-Einrohrdampferzeugers tätig.
Walter, 1880-1960, Dr. med. vet., Tierarzt, Oberstleutnant.
Walter, 1891-1967, Dr. phil., Sekundarlehrer in St.Moritz, Oberstleutnant.
Carl August, 1892-1974, Kaufmann, Bürgerrat, Bezirksrichter.
Otto, 1908-1982, Dr. phil., Gymnasiallehrer, Dozent an der Militärwissenschaftlichen Abteilung der ETH Zürich, Bürgerrat, Oberst i Gst.
Carl August, 1919-2000, lic. oec. HSG, Bürgerratspräsident von 1973-1988, Präsident des Bankrates der Ersparnisanstalt der Stadt St.Gallen, Präsident des Verbandes St.Gallischer Ortsgemeinden, Präsident des Ostschweizerischen Blindenfürsorgevereins, Oberst i Gst.

In der Ausgabe von 1887 sind als in Amerika lebend aufgeführt:
Johann Christian, *1813, Buchbinder in Amerika. Seit 1836 verheiratet mit Kleophea Steinmann (1807-1867). Sohn: Johann Kaspar Theodor * 1836.
Gottfrid, *1821, Kaufmann in Minneapolis, Amerika. Seit 1863 verheiratet mit Sophie Behn von Altona (*1841). Kinder: Gottfrid *1864, Emma *1867, Albert *1873.
Eduard, *1822, Kaufmann in New York. Seit 1854 verheiratet mit Jenny Cäcilie Mayer (1828-1885). Kinder: Luise Hedwig *1855, Maria *1858, Elwine *1860, Eduard *1861, Helena Karolina *1868.
Bernhard, *1828, Fabrikant in Amerika.
Karl Bernhard, *1828, Metzger in Uruguay. Seit 1857 verheiratet mit Anna Karolina Schläpfer von Rehetobel AR (*1839). Kinder: Karl Friedrich *1859, Karolina Augusta *1860, Henriette Angelina *1866, Hermann Theophil Gottlieb *1869, Adolf August *1875, Rosa Elise *1877.
Wilhelm, *1836, Kaufmann in St.Louis, Nordamerika. Seit 1863 verheiratet mit Margareth Appel. Sohn: Karl *1864.
Werner Bartholome, Weissgerber in Amerika. Seit 1870 verheiratet mit Katharina Elisabeth Dietrich (*1845). Kinder: Gustav Werner *1871, Maria Elise *1872, Auguste Karoline *1873, Adolf *1874, Albertine *1876, Ida *1877, Bertha Elise *1878.
Johann Emil, *1844, Kaufmann in St.Louis, Nordamerika. Seit 1872 verheiratet mit Wilhelmine Seibert aus Illinois. Tochter: Emma Hilda *1875.

In 1829 a first "Etat der Bürgerschaft der Stadt St.Gallen" was published - succeeded since 1864 by the "Bürgerbuch der Ortsbürgergemeinde St. Gallen", published not quite regularly, usually every 10 years. The edition of 2000 is available online (regsitration required, but free of charge). The following is an excerpt of several printed editions.

Scheitlin are an old St.Gallen family with no known origin. In Augsburg (Bavaria) there is a von Scheitlin family - but they are not connected to the St.Gallen Scheitlin. Between 1430 and 1530 a Schitli family is mentioned in St.Gallen: whilst the names are related ethymologically, there is no indication of any genealogical relationship.

The first Scheitlin mentioned in St.Gallen in 1511 is Hans. Common ancestor of all present day Scheitlins is Anton, 1566-1629, master bleacher; 24 of his descendants over 10 generations have been (master) bleachers. The German version (above) mentions several later individuals.

The 1887 edition lists the following individuals as living in America:
Johann Christian, *1813, book binder in Amerika. Since 1836 married to Kleophea Steinmann (1807-1867). Son: Johann Kaspar Theodor * 1836.
Gottfrid, *1821, merchant in Minneapolis, Amerika. Since 1863 married to Sophie Behn of Altona (*1841). Children: Gottfrid *1864, Emma *1867, Albert *1873.
Eduard, *1822, merchant in New York. Since 1854 married to Jenny Cäcilie Mayer (1828-1885). Children: Luise Hedwig *1855, Maria *1858, Elwine *1860, Eduard *1861, Helena Karolina *1868.
Bernhard, *1828, factory owner in Amerika.
Karl Bernhard, *1828, butcher in Uruguay. Since 1857 married to Anna Karolina Schläpfer of Rehetobel AR (*1839). Children: Karl Friedrich *1859, Karolina Augusta *1860, Henriette Angelina *1866, Hermann Theophil Gottlieb *1869, Adolf August *1875, Rosa Elise *1877.
Wilhelm, *1836, merchant in St.Louis, Nordamerika. Since 1863 married to Margareth Appel. Son: Karl *1864.
Werner Bartholome, tanner in Amerika. Since 1870 married to Katharina Elisabeth Dietrich (*1845). Children: Gustav Werner *1871, Maria Elise *1872, Auguste Karoline *1873, Adolf *1874, Albertine *1876, Ida *1877, Bertha Elise *1878.
Johann Emil, *1844, merchant in St.Louis, Nordamerika. Since 1872 married to Wilhelmine Seibert aus Illinois. Daughter: Emma Hilda *1875.

[Nemeses]

Wolf, I want to thank you again for your great assistance in my questions on the Scheitlin family. You've been most helpful, and have confirmed some of the assumptions I had made, and given me new information which will help me continue my research on the family.

Again, my thanks to you.

[Wolf]

Unfortunately the publications mentioned by Mario von Moos for "Vadiana St.Gallen" could not be located. The problem is that "Vadiana" is a single name for several archives/libraries, spread over different buildings in different parts of the town; this makes locating sources difficult without further detail or shelf numbers. Paul d'Aujourd'hui and myself have checked several of these institutions unsuccessfully - none of them had these publications on their catalogue. Instead, however, I have found a beautifully written and leather bound manuscript on the Scheitlin genealogy, dated 1770, in the manuscript collection of the cantonal library (part of Vadiana). The following, however, is an extract of Stemmatologia Sangallensis: only the direct line has been copied - one could easily spend days copying all the descendants and/or information on many maternal lines contained in "Stemma" - which unfortunately just exceeds the time I can spend on a single request.

01) Hanß Schaitlin (Scheidtli) - nothing is known about him apart from the fact that he had (at least) two sons: Hanß and Antoni.

02) Antoni Schaitlin (the son) was married to Elsbetha Künzli.

03) Hanß Scheitlin (16 Aug 1536 - 09 Mar 1597) married 21 May 1559 Anna Lörer (died 25 Jan 1587).

04) Antoni Schaitlin (19 Feb 1566 - 17 Sep 1629) was married three times - second time 05 Dec 1602 to Barbara Straub (died 30 Sep 1625) of Straubenzell (then an independent community, now part of the city of St.Gallen).

05) Thomas Schaitlin (22 Jul 1615 - 11 Dec 1672) marries 1642 Anna Maria Müller (died 12 Jan 1696) "aus dem Berner Gebiet" (from the region of Bern).

06) Martin Schaitlin (30 Jul 1644 - 23 Mar 1699), locksmith, marries 31 Dec 1677 Barbara Rietmann (23 Sep 1656 - 17 Oct 1724), d.of Jacob Rietmann and Magdalena Luz.

07) Hs (Hans) Martin Scheitlin (11 Dec 1688 - 01 Jul 1777), carpenter, was married four times, first time 28 Sep 1714 with Eva Walder (06 Dec 1684 - 19 Nov 1727), d.of Jacob Waldner and Elisabetha Stöckli.

08) Hs (Hans) Martin Scheitlin (27 Sep 1725 - 08 Apr 1782), shoemaker, was maried three times, first 27 Jul 1751 with Margaretha Hiller (22 Jun 1717 - 21 Dec 1772), d.of Heinrich Hiller and Magd(alena) Schirmer.

09) Hs (Hans) Martin Scheitlin (11 Aug 1753 - 13 Jul 1833) shoemaker, was married twice, first with Anna Elis(abeth) Ehrenzeller (20 Dec 1757 - 31 Jan 1814), d.of Daniel Ehrenzeller and Othilia Appenzeller.
Daniel is not mentioned on another Ehrenzeller listing published on SwissGen - this is just one of the lines worth further evaluation of "Stemmatologia".

10) Bartholome Schaitlin (04 May 1792 - 24 Apr 1845), carpenter, married 17 Aug 1813 Elsbetha Kuhn from Rhein... (20 Sep 1787 - 28 May 1839); this marriage was divorced, but the couple had children baptised from 1814 to 1830. Also mentioned is the illegitimate daughter (24 Feb 1833) of Bartholome Schaitlin with A.M. (Anna Maria) Bundt, "abgeschiedene Vonwiller" (most likely implying that he had been married to a Vonwiller, but was divorced as well); no marriage of Batholome Schaitlin and Anna Maria Bundt is mentioned.

11) Martin Sebastian Schaitlin (11 Feb 1814 - 14 Feb 1874) - see your own data above.
- Editiert von Wolf am 19.08.2005, 19:53 -

[Nemeses]

I have just spend much time adding this information to my research, Wolf. Once again, I'm in your debt for your excellent information and sources, and for the time you have taken to assist me in the Scheitlin family history. You and Paul d'Aujourd'hui have both provided invaluable help, and I thank you.

[bee2]

Ich probiere auf Deutsch zu schreiben...wenn es zu schwer ist werde ich vielleicht auf Englisch etwas sagen oder vielleicht mehr.

Meine Grossmutter (die Mutter meines Vaters) war die Tochter von:

Constance Eleanore Scheitlin
So Constance or "Connie" wie sie in der Familie genannt wurde war mein Urgrossmutter und es gibt eine Fotografie die sie zeigt mit mir als ein Baby (ich bin in 1946 geboren und sie starb 3 Jahre spater in 1949)
Constance war die Tochter von Othmar Scheitlin. Der wurde in Cape Town, Sudafrika in 1895 gestorben (International genealogical Index).

Ich schreibe hier zu finden ob meine Suche irgendwie helfen kann, if I can in any way help others who also descend from the Scheitlins in Sankt Gallen. And in turn they may know something about the branch I descend from. In any case I also feel I am a "cousin" to any descendent on whatever continent he/she finds him/herself. It is so interesting to discover all these different destinies.

I had no idea some Scheitlins emigrated to the USA. Entschuldigung es so viel leichter fur mich auf Englisch zu schreiben...I will carry on now in English.

Constance's father Othmar Scheitlin was either a ship captain or a ship owner in Cape Town. All I know is from hearsay from my family. His ship my grannny had a painting of on her wall provided a shuttle service between Cape Town and the English island of Santa Helena in the middle of the Atlantic ocean. Constance spent some of her childhood in Cape Town but later the family moved back to Switzerland apparently to sort out some financial problems but Constance and her mum ended up never returning to South Africa for some reason. International Genealogical Index tells me the father Othmar Scheitlin, the sea captain, died in Cape Town in 1895 so why the rest of the family stayed behind in Saint Gall I have no idea. My research is only starting and there is only so much you can find on the Internet in genealogy.

I was personally born in Geneva, spent many years in France and live now in the UK.

I look forward to more contacts with you guys who seem to know so much more than I do at this stage on the Scheitlin family tree.

[Hunger]

hello
in my library I've 2 books (edition 1940 & 1990) "Bürgerbuch der Ortsbürgergemeinde St.Gallen" showing all the SCHEITLIN with citizenship St. Gallen. If you are interested you can send me a email, and I will send you the scans (in German!)
best regards
kilian

[Wolf]

Extract from the 1887 issue of “Bürgerbuch der Ortsbürgergemeinde ..”:

Otmar Bernhard Scheitlin (born 1816), merchant, son of Otmar, bleacher (deceased), 1852 married to Johanna Sibylla Pietersen from Holland (born 1830). Children:
1. Antoinette (born 1850), 1868 married to Heinrich Knecht, ironmonger of Hinwil ZH.
2. Constance Eleonore (born 1865), 1885 married to Arthur Hippolyt Mayer, merchant (see below).

Otmar had a brother Eduard (born 1822, married to Jenny Cäcilie Mayer) and a stepsister Susanna (born 1808, married to Hans Jakob Eichholzer).

Nothing mentioned about Otmar’s whereabouts - but his brother Eduard is given as merchant in New York.

Arthur Konradin Hippolyt Mayer, also citizen of St.Gallen (born 1859), son of Alexis Hippolyt, merchant (deceased).

According to the 1901 issue the couple had 4 children:
1. Constanze Helene (1886)
2. Jenny Fride (1887)
3. Viktor Bernhard (1889)
4. Maria Doris Johanna (1893)
So - who’s your grandmother?

[bee2]

Wolf I just wrote a VERY LONG message back to you and Hunger explaining who everybody is that you Wolf mention in your message. Also to thank you both for your kind answers and saying sorry but I couldn't answer them before now.

I clicked on "abschicken". Unfortunately it seems my message never reached here on the forum...quite sad as it took me a long time to type it...technology sometimes fails. I am going to write to the administrator perhaps to ask if they have a trrace of my message.

I can't write it now for the 2nd time but I will as soon as I find the time.

All I can say here is that my grandmother was Jenny Fride. To us and other people (she signed articles as a journalist) she was "Frieda". I don't know why.
And we knew Constanze Helene as "Nelly", probably short for "Helene".

I will talk to you again in the coming days (re-write my disappeared message).

[bee2]

Wolf I realize now you are the Moderator. Maybe you can see my disappeared message in the system somewhere. Just maybe.

It will teach me a lesson:when messages get long, it is a good idea to save them as you go along just in case they vanish into thin air...

[Wolf]

Hi bee2,

I am very sorry to hear that you spent a lot of time for a long contribution - and it disappeared. I do not see a chance to retrieve this text, however, if it has not reached the forum server - and if it had reached the server, it would be shown.

Let me add that I am only one of the moderators - not the administrator: I cannot access the database myself - but as I said, I do not think the admin (Nico Müller) can help you either.

I have seen the occasional glitch when going to review first - and then edit, when the text went into a black hole. I have never seen that when posting directly. Independent of that - I always write long texts in my word processor (which I find much more comfortable to use) - and then copy&paste into the forum.

[bee2]

Thanks for your quick repsonse, Wolf and your advice. Well astronomists say black holes exist in the Universe so this is where my words went or it is a trick by all the Scheitlins I was talking about in the message, a joke they are playing on me ...
I'll be back soon with a fresh text to replace that one.

[bee2]

First of all many thanks to Hunger and Wolf for your rapid help with my search.


Now in replacement for my lost message yesterday:
I am not sure this is of interest for any of you as these are only my branch of the family, If anyone else branches out from any of these people, please let me know that you are my not so remote cousins.

I will take these names in the order they appear in Wolf’s kind informative message and add reflections or the little information I have from family or from International Genealogical Index (Google):

Otmar Bernhard Scheitlin born 1816 died in Cape Town in 1895 married to Johanna Sibylla Pieteresen, 14 years younger than himself and born in St Gallen albeit from a Dutch family. No idea when the Pietersens arrived in S.Gallen and why. They had 2 daughters, Antoinette and my greatgrandmother Constanze Eleonore

Constanze Eleonore :
the story ran in the family that the 4 of them returned from South Africa to deal with some financial difficulty (their bank was in trouble),planning to return, but that in the meantime their elder daughter got married while they were in Switzerland and they couldn’t go back to South Africa in order to stay near her. At least Constanze and her mother Johanna didn’t because apparently the father Otmar did return as I found he died in Cape Town.

I find here that my greatgrandmother was…15 years younger than her sister.

I should search for Antoinette’s descendants I have never heard about in the family.

There is a photograph of me as a baby on Constanze's lap (I was born in 1946, she died in 1949).

She was known in the family as “Connie”.

Otmar Bernhard Scheitlin had a brother, Eduard who emigrated to America.I was unaware of this. This is a lead to possible further research of “American cousins”. Nemeses are you related to him in any way?

Arthur Konradin Hippolyt Mayer is my greatgrandfather (Constanzes’s husband).
Their children:
-Constanze Helene (1886) my grandmother and everybody else always called Nelly so I am discovering here her real first names. Nelly must be short for Helene.
She was domineering and bossy and my grandmother feared her occasional visits to her in Geneva (Nelly lived in Zurich). But she must have been very attached to her because when Nelly died my grandmother declined rapidly.

I have met her at my grandmother’s when she visited.

She studied the violin at great expense to her parents and was probably very talented. She was her mother Constanze’s favourite daughter and my grandmother suffered from this.

She transmitted her love of music to her son who became the Orchestra Conductor Peter Maag.


-Jenny Fride (1887) is my grandmother. I knew of “Jenny” but didn’t know it was actually her fist name and not second. The first name she used in her life was “Frieda”.

I don’t know why she and her sister didn’t use their real first names in their everyday life. In her family as to her close friends she was also known as “Mitzi” which it seems is a german affectionate name for a little cat.

-Viktor Bernhard (1889) I met him too, at least once when he visited to see my new-born brother in 1957. He had worked for the firm Pirelli, first in Milan and then for many years in Indonesia where I think he was the firm’s representative. He never married. He died before his 2 sisters in Zurich where he lived in his late years.

-Maria Doris Johanna (1893). Now poor little Doris died as a child (perhaps approx. 12 years old) from peritonitis. I vividly remember a photograph of her and she looked very kind which made me feel really sad. My grandmother mentioned her occasionally and used the name “Doris”, never Maria.

I don’t know if it was the fashion of the time but none of these 3 sisters were called by their real names.

I hope this is not too boring reading. After all it is only my branch of the family and you may not be interested in them particularly. Thank you again Wolf and Hunger for your great help.

[bee2]

Die Mutter von Constanze Scheitlin (1865 geboren) war in Holland in 1830 in einer hollandischen Familie geboren. Ihr Name war: Johanna Sybilla Pietersen.
I would like to know more about her and if/how this Dutch family came to be in Sankt Gallen. Does anyone know how I could find this out? If possible while remaining seated in front of my computer ...Many Thanks for any help!
- Editiert von Wolf am 28.11.2008, 18:43 -

[Wolf]

This will be difficult - and the Dutch family did not necessarily come to St.Gallen: Constanze's father was a merchant - and likely travelling a lot on business. He could have met his (later) wife during a business trip to The Netherlands.

[Schwpz]

Original von Wolf
Instead, however, I have found a beautifully written and leather bound manuscript on the Scheitlin genealogy, dated 1770, in the manuscript collection of the cantonal library (part of Vadiana). The following, however, is an extract of Stemmatologia Sangallensis: only the direct line has been copied - one could easily spend days copying all the descendants and/or information on many maternal lines contained in "Stemma" - which unfortunately just exceeds the time I can spend on a single request.

01) Hanß Schaitlin (Scheidtli) - nothing is known about him apart from the fact that he had (at least) two sons: Hanß and Antoni.

02) Antoni Schaitlin (the son) was married to Elsbetha Künzli.

03) Hanß Scheitlin (16 Aug 1536 - 09 Mar 1597) married 21 May 1559 Anna Lörer (died 25 Jan 1587).

04) Antoni Schaitlin (19 Feb 1566 - 17 Sep 1629) was married three times - second time 05 Dec 1602 to Barbara Straub (died 30 Sep 1625) of Straubenzell (then an independent community, now part of the city of St.Gallen).

Hello, I'm looking for the descendant of the Scheitlin family of St. Gallen as well
Sadly the names I have doesn't seem to quite fit into the many trees displayed in this topic.

My Scheitlin tree climbing starts with Anna Magdalena Scheitlin (1771-1835, St. Gallen).
She was the daughter of Anton (1737-1817) and Anna Magdalena Scheitlin.
Anton was the son of David (1706-1752) and Ursula Scheitlin, who in turn was the son of Antoni (1683-1756) and Anna Scheitlin.
Antoni was the son of David (1653-1732) and Elisabetha Scheitlin, who in turn was the son of Antoni and Ursula Scheitlin. They are all born and dead in St. Gallen.

So Antoni and his wife Ursula (probably born in the early 1600) are the oldest links I have in my Scheitlin tree.

Based upon Wolf's previous post I'm starting to think that my Scheitlin line might perhaps descend from one of Antoni Scheitlin senior's (1566-1629) other wives, since only his second wife is mentioned in this thread and I can't seem to fit my tree in the names mentioned here.
Does anyone have any information that might help cover the bridge from "my" Antoni Scheitlin of the 1600 to "your" Antoni Scheitlin (1566-1629)?

I'm also extremely curious about the beautifully written and leather bound manuscript on the Scheitlin genealogy that Wolf mentioned - are there perhaps any scans floating around in cyberspace of this manuscript? Sorry, but I have a seriously weak spot for old books and manuscripts, so I just had to ask! :-O



Thanks for all the information in this topic, and happy new year! ;;;

[Wolf]

Hi Schwpz,

your line goes back to the same couple:

04) Antoni Schaitlin (19 Feb 1566 - 17 Sep 1629) was married three times - second time 05 Dec 1602 to Barbara Straub (died 30 Sep 1625) of Straubenzell (then an independent community, now part of the city of St.Gallen).

Thomas Schaitlin (22 Jul 1615 - 11 Dec 1672) was not their only child - he had an older brother (amongst others):

05) Gallus Scheitlin (16 Oct 1604 - 19 Dec 1680) marries 13 Feb 1626 Anna Appenzeller (15 Jan 1601 - 21 Jan 1634), daughter of Hans Appenzeller (#63 in Stemmatologia).

06) Anton Scheitlin (16 Feb 1628 - 12 Jan 1705) marries 07 Dec 1652 Ursula Merz (11 Feb 1624 - 04 Aug 1706), daughter of David Merz (#27).

07) David Scheitlin (16 Dec 1653 - 28 Apr 1731: note the year!) = your David.

[Daniel Tobler]

Ich habe ein Album mit verschiedenen Fotos (die bestimmt um die 120 Jahre alt sind) auf denen verschiedene Familienmitglieder der Familien Scheitlin und Schneider abgebildet sind. So unter anderem auch:

Gottfried Scheitlin
J.C. Oswald-Scheitlin (Senator in Cincinati/Ohio)
Robert Schneider-Zwicker
Gottfried Schneider
Familie Schneider-Scheitlin
Familie Martin Schneider-Greter (ausgewandert nach Amerika, New Jersey, retour 1910 nach Herisau)
Familie Kaspar und Elisabeth Schneider-Göldi, Heiden
usw.

Hat jemand Interesse an diesen Fotos? Die meisten sind mit den Personennamen beschriftet. Bestimmt ein wertvolle Ergänzung für eine allenfalls bestehende Familienchronik.

[waldy]

Wow, lieber Herr Tobler, das sind ja sensationelle Neuigkeiten!!! J.C. Oswald-Scheitlin war mein Ururgrossonkel und ich habe in den letzten 10 Jahren in mühseliger (aber hoch spannender Kleinarbeit) die familiären Zusammenhänge der Oswalds, Scheitlins, Schneiders etc. erforscht und zu Papier gebracht. Die von Ihnen aufgelisteten Namen sind mir bestens bekannt und ich würde mich SEHR über diese Fotos freuen. Können wir alles Weitere auf direktem Weg besprechen?
Herzlichen Dank für einen Bescheid.
B. Oswald (waldy)

[geronimo4ever]

Vielleicht ist es für gestandene Genealogen ein alter Hut...

Im Wikipedia unter http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/J._Edgar_H ... ry_62f_0-0 steht, dass die Mutter von J. Edga Hoover eine Anna Marie Scheitlin (1860–1938) ist mit Dickerson Naylor Hoover (1856–1921) verheiratet.

Als St. Galler denkt man natürlich sofort an den aktuellen Stadtpräsidenten sowie Scheitlins generell. Stammt J. Edgar Hoover gar von der St. Galler Linie ab?

[waldy]

Ja, das ist so; J. Edgar Hoover, der Begründer des FBI, stammt mütterlicherseits aus einer St. Galler Scheitlin-Linie.
Herbert Ivan Scheitlin (1903-1993) schreibt in seinem Buch "Genealogy of the Scheitlin Families" auf Seite 40ff. über seine Korrespondenz mit diesem Familienzweig.
Hoover's Mutter, Anna Marie Scheitlin (1860-1938), war die Tochter von Jacob Scheitlin (1823-1880) und Margaretha Hitz (*1834 in Klosters, Graubünden). Jacob war Maschinist in Washington D.C., wurde aber noch in St. Gallen geboren. Herbert I. Scheitlin schliesst seine Ausführung mit der Annahme, dass die Washington-Scheitlins von Gallus Scheitlin (1604-1680) abstammen.
Etwas detaillierte, aber zum Teil auch abweichende Informationen liefert ein Stammbaum auf http://www.ancestry.com:
Anna Marie Scheitlin (12.09.1859[1860], Washington D.C. - 22.02.1938, Washington D.C.)
Eltern: Jacob Scheitlin (07.04.1823, St. Gallen - 09.04.1880, Washington D.C.) und
Margaret Hitz (24.03.1833, Virginia USA - 1894, Washington D.C.)
Grosseltern: Johann Joachim Scheitlin (*1792) und Juditha Holzer (*1787)
Die Angaben zu Margaret(tha) Hitz sind etwas widersprüchlich. Wahrscheinlich kam sie als Tochter des späteren Schweizer Generalkonsuls Johann/John Hitz (und Anna Kohler) bereits in den USA zur Welt. Die St. Galler Scheitlin-Abstammung scheint jedoch eindeutig. Ob es eine Verbindung zu eurem Stadtpräsidenten gibt, kann ich leider nicht sagen...

[geronimo4ever]

Wunderbar, besten Dank für die Antwort. Das bietet Stoff für eine gute Story.. Mein Nachbar ist ja Genealoge und hat viel über die St. Galler Familien recherchiert. Ich schlage das mal in seinem Buch nach.

[Säntis]

Am 5.3.1854 wurde in Eggerstanden, Kt. AI, Elisabeth FELIX, die illegitime Tochter der Elisabeth FELIX getauft.
Gemäss Akten im Bundesarchiv in Bern war der Vater ein N.N. SCHEITLIE, der zu diesem Zeitpunkt im Kt. AR. wohnte.
Mit grosser Wahrscheinlichkeit muss es sich beim Vater um einen St. Galler Bürger gehandelt haben.
Jeder noch so kleine Hinweis zur Identifikation des Vaters ist willkommen.

Bochtella

[Säntis]

Grüezi Lesende,

konnte diesen Toten Punkt noch nicht überwinden.

Findet sich eventuell in der Stemmatologia Sangallensis ein ausserehelicher Vater der zeitlich passen könnte?

Bochtella

[Wolf]

Ich war heute in der Vadiana - leider findet sich weder im Taufbuch ein entsprechender Taufeintrag - noch in der "Stemma" ein Hinweis auf eine passende uneheliche Geburt.

[Säntis]

Guten Abend Wolf,

einen ganz herzlichen Dank für das Nachschlagen im Taufbuch und in der "Stemma".
Da habe ich also eine ganz harte Nuss im Korb.

Mit freundlichem Gruss aus Schaffhausen,
Bochtella

[stephe]

Angabe aus dem Registerauszug der fremdkantonalen Aufenthalter in der Stadt Bern
Am 31.23.1911 meldeten sich in der Stadt Bern, von Luzern kommend, an :

Bühlmann Josef Alois, von Rain (geb. 28.11.1842, Sohn des Josef Bühlmann und Barbara Iten) und Ehefrau
Scheitlin Auguste Emilie. St. Gallen geboren 12.6.1845 , Tochter von Johann Josef Scheitlin und Ruth Wild.
In diesem Registereintrag steht unter „Civilstand“: 30.8.1867 in St. Gallen (Ich nehme an, dass ist Heiratsdatum und -ort). Leider habe ich keine Ahnung in welchen Pfarrbüchern in St.Gallen ich Angaben dazu finden könnte.
Jede kleinste Angabe über Auguste Emilie Scheitlin, ihren Eltern Johann Josef Scheitlin und Ruth Wild, ev. Geschwister und näheres über die Heirat mit Josef Alois Bühlmann, wären also sehr willkommen.

Sekundäre Info: Auguste Emilie Scheitlin hatte mindestens 2 Nichten (ev. Kinder eines Bruders?):
Albertine Wilhelmine Bernardina Scheitlin (genannt Dina) und Minna Johanna Scheitlin (gestorben 1927 )
Auch diese Schwestern waren aus St. Gallen und wohnten in Bern seit ca. 1898. Zuvor reisten sie eine Zeitlang in USA, wahrscheinlich nach St. Louis.
Auch hier wäre jeder noch so kleine Hinweis zu diesen Scheitlin-Schwestern und ihren Eltern hilfreich.

Liebe Grüsse stephe

[Wolf]

Bühlmann Josef Alois, von Rain (geb. 28.11.1842, Sohn des Josef Bühlmann und Barbara Iten). und Ehefrau
Scheitlin Auguste Emilie. St. Gallen geboren 12.6.1845 , Tochter von Johann Josef Scheitlin und Ruth Wild.
In diesem Registereintrag steht unter „Civilstand“: 30.8.1867 in St. Gallen (Ich nehme an, dass ist Heiratsdatum und -ort).

Hallo stephe,

die Kirchenbücher des Kantons St.Gallen sind online zugänglich (nach Ablauf der Sperrfristen). Leider sind die Kirchenbücher der Stadt ab 1841 nicht besonders übersichtlich. Zum Glück gibt es nach Familiennamen sortierte Register mit der Taufe der Auguste Emilie Scheitlin. Danach ist sie allerdings am 12.01.1845 geboren (als Mutter wird Barbara Katharina Wild angegeben) und hat am 30.09.1867 geheiratet. Um sicher zu sein, müssten hier also die Originaleinträge gesucht werden.

Um einen Überblick über die Familie zu bekommen, ist ein Nachschlagen in der Stemmatologia Sangallensis aber effektiver - im Familienblatt des Johann Joseph Scheitlin wird allerdings der 12.01.1844 [korrekt aber 12.01.1845] als Geburtstag der Tochter Augusta Emilie angegeben (Mutter ebenfalls Barbara Katharina Wild). Für spätere Generationen muss die weitergeführte Abschrift im Stadtarchiv St.Gallen konsultiert werden.